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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Apologies for being 1 of those unsociable tw4ts who joins a forum but never introduces themselves.

I have a UK 97 TL1000S that I’m trying to get going after 3 years of storage.

When I initially hit the starter button it went but ran mega rough, farting, coughing with some good pops.

I’ve changed quite a few bits to try & fix the prob including a Kemso pump. Did a flow test at the FPR & got 80ml of fuel from a single prime, ran a pressure test from the pump & it was 104psi on a single prime. Both these numbers are a lot higher than I was expecting!?!?

The old pump was only managing 24psi. Could these high numbers from the Kemso pump be causing more problems or are they typical?

Cheers
Phil
 

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When I walk into a pub I don't go an introduce myself either, don't worry. You seem to have tried a few things yourself so why wouldn't you be worthy of some pointers eh?

Anywho, that's a lot of pressure. Iirc injectors ought to run at 43psi, but might want to check that yourself. Are you testing the system with the original fuel pressure regulator in place? It's bolted to the side of the fuel rail, connected to the return line that flows back to the tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
When I walk into a pub I don't go an introduce myself either, don't worry. You seem to have tried a few things yourself so why wouldn't you be worthy of some pointers eh?

Anywho, that's a lot of pressure. Iirc injectors ought to run at 43psi, but might want to check that yourself. Are you testing the system with the original fuel pressure regulator in place? It's bolted to the side of the fuel rail, connected to the return line that flows back to the tank.
Cheers for the response.

I followed some of the guides on here to check pressure & flow. I disconnected the fuel delivery hose from the tank & connected a hose direct to that tank output to a pressure gauge & got 104psi when I turned the key.

To measure the flow I disconnected the return hose from the tank put it in a jug, turned the key & 80ml was pushed out through the fpr.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I’ve also cleaned the tank out, changed the plugs, put in a new fuel filter, had the injectors cleaned & flow tested.

No error codes show up in dealer mode & I’ve been through all the hoses & loom connectors.

I was confident after doing all this the bike would tick over perfectly. I’m starting to think it’s in the huff with me as I spent the last three years riding a newer bike!
 

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Seems like you are this close to evaluating the issue with the pressure yourself.

You covered a lot of other bases too, well done. Though there are two major things shining in absence. Being left alone for three years doesn't make it very logical they'de be off.. but how are the adjustments?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Seems like you are this close to evaluating the issue with the pressure yourself.

You covered a lot of other bases too, well done. Though there are two major things shining in absence. Being left alone for three years doesn't make it very logical they'de be off.. but how are the adjustments?
I’ll have another go at it next week when I get some time to escape to the garage. I’d like to set the TPS & balance the TBs but I’m guessing until I can get it to idle well I’ll be chasing my tail.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
No not really, just cautious about adjusting the TPS before I’ve sorted the erratic idling issue as it may interfere. Suppose I could mark it up so I can return to where I started if it doesn’t improve the running.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I’ve not given up yet.

Replaced vacuum lines today as they were starting to split - no change.

Checked plugs & they were wet with fuel which I expected as it is misfiring, gaps were fine tho.

Put a multimeter on the battery & it was at 12.5v, turned ignition on & voltage slowly dropped to 12.2v, started the engine & voltage picked up to 12.4v and didn’t move despite raising the revs. I was hoping it would go up to 14v!? Wondering if it’s worth buying a new battery.

Dunno if this may be linked but both of my headlights had blown, prior to this testing.

Also I read on here a way to check reg/rec stator is to unplug the reg & see if the bike runs. It did but still lumpy, backfiring & wanting to cut, so from that I think they are ok.

Can anyone spot an obvious issue?

Just to rule the fpr out I’m going to test the pressure at the banjo bolt on the manifold.

I haven’t messed with the TPS yet as I want to rule out as much as I can before I interfere with it. I did start it in dealer mode & the marker stayed at the lowest point even under revs.

Cheers Phil
 

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1998 TLS; 2001 TLR; 200X TLRSF
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Phil,
You have done well in addressing a number of problems. Given what you have reported in your latest post, I will offer some suggestions. These are things I would look at if it were mine, but they are by no means gospel.

....
Replaced vacuum lines today as they were starting to split - no change.

Checked plugs & they were wet with fuel which I expected as it is misfiring, gaps were fine tho.
You say you saw no change with the new vacuum lines. Did you retain the four small plastic jets inside vacuum lines? I can't say if their impact is significant, but when it comes down to fine tuning the idle, those jets may be an influence. However, even if they are gone, I don't think their absence is the primary issue with the lumpy idle.

Fuel-soaked spark plugs can fail and/or cause poor performance. Difficult to say if yours are at that point, but it is good to keep this in mind if all else fails.

Put a multimeter on the battery & it was at 12.5v, turned ignition on & voltage slowly dropped to 12.2v, started the engine & voltage picked up to 12.4v and didn’t move despite raising the revs. I was hoping it would go up to 14v!? Wondering if it’s worth buying a new battery.

Dunno if this may be linked but both of my headlights had blown, prior to this testing.
Headlight bulbs fail from age, vibration, and over-voltage. The voltages you measured were not excessive. In fact, the system voltage is lower than it should be, and this is the real indicator of a problem. The TL OEM charging system is not great. There are weak links in the circuit that cause it to underperform and even fail. The voltage at the battery should be at least 14 volts at 5K RPM. The voltages you measured are typical of a system that needs attention.

If you haven't seen it already, read through this thread in the Frequent Mods forum. It explains the flaws and the fix for the charging system. While most of the problem is in the OEM wire loom, many members have upgraded to a MOSFET rectifier/regulator (because it is more efficient and runs cooler), but the OEM SCR regulator will do the job if if is functional and the wiring is improved.

Definitive Charging System Diagnostic & Upgrade Thread

A battery that is perpetually under-charged doesn't perform at its best. It makes for difficult starting and a weak spark at the plugs. This may or may not be impacting your idle issue.


Also, I read on here a way to check reg/rec stator is to unplug the reg & see if the bike runs. It did but still lumpy, backfiring & wanting to cut, so from that I think they are ok.

Can anyone spot an obvious issue?

Just to rule the fpr out I’m going to test the pressure at the banjo bolt on the manifold.
When the stator is disconnected from the rectifier, the electrical system is completely reliant on the battery. In your case, the battery is only at 12.4v (or lower with the R/R disconnected), so that likely explains the poor engine performance.
If the battery is more than two years old (and since it has never been charged properly while in your TL), it is probably best to replace it (and fix the charging system).

You posted previously that the fuel pressure directly from the pump was great, and that's good. The fuel pressure regulators (FPR) rarely fail, but it's good to check the fuel rail pressure if you have the tools. Then you can cross it off your list.

I haven’t messed with the TPS yet as I want to rule out as much as I can before I interfere with it. I did start it in dealer mode & the marker stayed at the lowest point even under revs....
I think you have ruled out quite a few potential problems already, and now it is time to play with the throttle body balance and the TPS.
I say this for two reasons:
1) You have found that the TPS does not respond to throttle movement as it should. The 'dash mark' in the LCD window is not centered but stays on the low side. Therefore, something has changed.
2) The TB balance greatly affects the nature of the idle. You will see as you adjust it. The slightest movement of the adjustment screw can make the idle purr, go lumpy, or fall on its face.

You may need to go back and forth between the TB Balance and TPS adjustments to get it where it needs to be, but just remember to adjust the TPS last.

I'm looking forward to hear what you find. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for your detailed reply. I’ll order a battery then work my way through your suggestions. I didn’t change out the lines with the jets in them just cleaned them out as they appeared to still be in good condition.

I’ll report back with how I get on. The charging mod looks like a good idea, also want to look at doing the thermostat mod once she’s running again.

thanks for the help 👍🏻
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Sorted 🥳

Put a new battery on it but it made no difference.

Got the multimeter out & tested RR, got the values as detailed in the manual. Tested the resistance on the stator & again all within the manual specs.

While looking at the manual noticed the battery leak test. So did as it explained & found that I was losing amps. Went through the harness disconnecting to isolate the leak. Pretty much done all of them, diss’d the TRE/gear indicator & the connector came apart in my hands! Once disconnected though the leak shown on the multimeter dropped to zero. Whoever had installed the TRE had done a proper sh1t job. Redone the wiring but the leak persisted. So took the TRE out & put it back to standard & the leak dropped to zero. Turned the bike over took a bit to get it going but once warmed up it’s running sweet, idles perfectly, revs clean & drops back to idle with no stumbles or backfires.

Over the moon! Time to recommission & get it ready for some classic trackdays 🤩

Thanks for all your help & suggestions, I’ve learnt a ton from reading the info & following your guidance 👍🏻
 

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....... Once disconnected though the leak shown on the multimeter dropped to zero. Whoever had installed the TRE had done a proper sh1t job. Redone the wiring but the leak persisted. So took the TRE out & put it back to standard & the leak dropped to zero. Turned the bike over took a bit to get it going but once warmed up it’s running sweet, idles perfectly, revs clean & drops back to idle with no stumbles or backfires.
.......
Phil, that's great news! Thanks for the update! 👍


Can anyone suggest a waterproof connector I could use to do a permanent job on my temp/test wiring?
.....
These Amphenol connectors are quality items. They are an upgrade over OEM.

Amphenol Deutsch AT-DT Type Connector and Terminals
 
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