you probably left a shim or 2 out in the box
Transmission problems
Hi Everyone
i bought a banged up 97 tl1000s, a few months ago. Exhaust shim bucket cracked and cotters
damaged cylinder head, piston, cylinder wall and one gear on transmission.
i proceeded to get all the parts together and i rebuilt the engine, once i started it,
it was running fine, but when i put it into gear, i could hear what sounded like
it catched on a gear (rattling sound) it sounded like the dogs of two gears touching
each other very slightly, i went for a test drive and could immediately feel that the clutch
was slipping, i went a bit further, and the bike stalled the rear wheel and felt
like it was stuck in gear, the chain was also very loose. took it home and
after much deliberation with my friend i decided to strip down again,
(it could still start in neutral, but once it revved up a bit, the sound came again).
once opened i noticed that three gears were damaged, one broke 3 teeth, another
just 1, and another just slightly damaged. if i look at the micro fiche i will tell you
exactly which ones were damaged, if that info is needed for better problem solving
i believe the clutch slipping is something
completely different, my question is just, what can cause massive failure like that
besides contamination of some sort?, all that i could find at the bottom of the engine
was the broken teeth.
thank you in advance for any input.
i bought a banged up 97 tl1000s, a few months ago. Exhaust shim bucket cracked and cotters
damaged cylinder head, piston, cylinder wall and one gear on transmission.
i proceeded to get all the parts together and i rebuilt the engine, once i started it,
it was running fine, but when i put it into gear, i could hear what sounded like
it catched on a gear (rattling sound) it sounded like the dogs of two gears touching
each other very slightly, i went for a test drive and could immediately feel that the clutch
was slipping, i went a bit further, and the bike stalled the rear wheel and felt
like it was stuck in gear, the chain was also very loose. took it home and
after much deliberation with my friend i decided to strip down again,
(it could still start in neutral, but once it revved up a bit, the sound came again).
once opened i noticed that three gears were damaged, one broke 3 teeth, another
just 1, and another just slightly damaged. if i look at the micro fiche i will tell you
exactly which ones were damaged, if that info is needed for better problem solving
i believe the clutch slipping is something
completely different, my question is just, what can cause massive failure like that
besides contamination of some sort?, all that i could find at the bottom of the engine
was the broken teeth.
thank you in advance for any input.
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
Hi
I forgot to mention that there was actually a shim left out, I don't mean
To sound stupid, even though I probably will, is the transmission that sensitive to spacing etc?
I forgot to mention that there was actually a shim left out, I don't mean
To sound stupid, even though I probably will, is the transmission that sensitive to spacing etc?
Hi Ring-in, any reply on the above question, please.....
Since Stu guessed your problem before you admitted it :hail I will answer for him (he is sleeping with his teddy bear collection right now :rotfl ).Hi
I forgot to mention that there was actually a shim left out, I don't mean
To sound stupid, even though I probably will, is the transmission that sensitive to spacing etc?
YES! The engine tolerances throughout are extremely tight. That's like saying, my clutch cover is leaking and I left off the o ring. Is it important?
The shims keep things.. well... shimmed to the proper spacing. So clean out all the broken bits (find the teeth and I would change oil and filter just to be safe), then rebuild tranny, replacing any broken parts and try again. Double and triple check your work. Glad you turned back and didn't try an Italian tune up to "clear" the problem.
Thank you very much for the input, just a pity you have to strip the whole engine to get to the tranny, I was really looking forward to enjoying my first tl, and was probably a bit too hasty and negligent in making sure of everything. Will do as you said and give feedback once its going again, thank you once more guys.
Good Luck with the rebuilt post up some pics as you go through the rebuilt they help lots.
Hi again, just another question that I wanted to ask, are all the engine casings the same, I know that you get different ones, I think; a, b and c, (main bearing differences I believe)do they differ in any way where the transmission is involved? I once again forgot to mention that I had to buy a second hand pair of engine casings, because the original ones were damaged. Sorry for the bits and pieces of info.
the early and later cases have different thickness output shaft bearings behind the sprocket. ( wider bearing )
another place you could have excess sideplay if you got it wrong
another place you could have excess sideplay if you got it wrong
Stu,the early and later cases have different thickness output shaft bearings behind the sprocket. ( wider bearing )
another place you could have excess sideplay if you got it wrong
Year change so he knows where to look / steer clear of?
Just an FYI for him as I have no idea. :confused
Stu will confirm, but 97 S's have different heads than the 'rest' too. Not that it has any bearing (<=== I kill myself! :laugh )
Not that it has any bearing (<=== I kill myself! :laugh )
:banghead Now, what did I do with that BAN button... :laugh
You are just mad because the voices in my head talk to me and not you. :rotfl:banghead Now, what did I do with that BAN button... :laugh
But to keep things relevant:
cpwelgemoed,
Seriously post up some pictures. Best case (<= I will leave that one alone.) we notice issues or find something. Worst case, you have visual references should you, say, forget where something went. Oh and when I say 'we', I mean the big boys... I am just here for terrible puns.
the bearing is 1mm wider on the later cases. not sure of the change over.
compare the case depth from original to new
compare the case depth from original to new
I'll have a look at the bearing size during lunch, it makes a lot of sense, because I had a lot of end float play (+- 4mm) on the output shaft when it started with the problems, (rookie tl engine builder)I should have known something more sinister was going on, I will be really happy if this is the case then I know what was the main cause, besides the one shim that was left out by mistake. Will give feedback this afternoon.
O and one more thing, I really do enjoy the comments and the laughs, glad to see everyone is not always taking life so seriously, thanks. This is a great forum!
side play should be 0.5mm or less
well, there`s yer problem. as you can see, the casings differ on the pics, don`t know what
the tri-angular plate does,(tried to get it off just now, but the screws are a bit stubborn) but the bearing on that one is wider by about 1mm in its width.
and if i measure the distance from where the bearing sits in the casing towards the crank,
(i know its not very accurate) it measures to almost 3-4mm different to the other one,
so there are definitely some differences.
Well it's obvious really, I've obtained a later model's casings and I see that the bearing on the later model is wider, 20mm and not 18mm like my v model as the manual refers to it. It also has the retainer for the bearing that the v model doesn't. And it's on the retainer that the gear touched if you look closely at the picture.
Ok, so I'll probably swap the bearings over, change the broken bits and try again?
Ok, so I'll probably swap the bearings over, change the broken bits and try again?
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
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