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Discussion Starter #1
Disappointing Dyno results 102bhp from a TLR engine with TLS throttle bodies and ECU.
Full custom map by FW Developments Preston with a PC11
All wrapped up in a Cagiva Navigator.
What dyno results have other people got from this conversion?
Improvement suggestions welcome.:confused:
 

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Why did you fit TLS throttle bodies to an R engine? two injectors v four injectors?

R throttle bodies, loom and ecu + pcIII would be the better way to go.
 

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The Suck, Squeeze, Bang, Blow Moderator,
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TLS or TLR engine is pretty much the same regarding power, the R has slightly higher compression and a bit more lift on the inlet cams, but only really good for a couple of extra bhp.

Same goes for the ECU/throttle bodies, same amount of fuel and air, just different approach, give same power.

Are you running a stock exhaust and airbox ? Not sure on the Navigator but the Raptor has the same airbox as the TLS but without the longer inlet RAM Air Tubes which loses about 5 bhp (nothing to do with ram air, everything to do with intake length)

I would expect around 115 at the rear wheel.

What was the fueling like ?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
The advice before the conversion was TLS throttle bodies and ECU. from memory ( did the conversion last year) the angles on the throttle bodies/ rubbers are different and as its a Navigator this overcame wiring issues I suppose. Easiest?
the bike is running on stock exhausts and air filter. I think the air box may be smaller and narrower than the TLs/Raptor as the frame is different from the Raptor
Not sure what you mean about fuelling. The bike was said to be running rich in the midrange and lean up top. Only about 3 bhp increase after map.(Correction : effective increase 14 bhp as engine was changed from detuned TLS/Navigator to TLR and now adjusted upwards by 10% to allow direct comparison of claimed crankshaft bhp with rear wheel bhp.)
It is running significantly better especially throttle response but the glitch at 70 to 80 degrees remains.
 

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The fueling - refering to the A/f ratio.

did you get a print out of the result? scan it and post it.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Contacted FW Developments and they tell me it is a Dynojet dyno which is inertia based.
There is nostrain gauge so no calibration is necessary.
Will try again to upload the map (newbie)
 

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The Suck, Squeeze, Bang, Blow Moderator,
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Contacted FW Developments and they tell me it is a Dynojet dyno which is inertia based.
Was speaking to Ian there last week before I posted a pair of heads to him for bigger valves....:)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I have no quibbles with the service or professionalism of FW. I only mention them by name as
they are probably well known locally for there excellent reputation.
I went there after poor experiences at 2 other places.
The issue remains. Suggestions welcome as are other users figures/experiences.
 

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air box and pipes would be my guess....do yo know much about the history of the engine.....?maybe down on compression?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Had the compression checked before install at local Suzuki dealer. Came within range. Possible it could have deteriorated.
Might be worth a recheck. Thanks
 

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I can understand your disappointment with those results, I'd start with a compression check then look at modifying the airbox and a better exhaust, helping it to breathe both on the inlet charge and the zorst can only help.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
TLR compression pressure range specifications

Anyone know the pressure range specifications. Arranged compression test locally.
 

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The Suck, Squeeze, Bang, Blow Moderator,
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Anyone know the pressure range specifications. Arranged compression test locally.
Leak Down Test is better, if you go for the compression test you will need to wedge the cam decompresors which means radiator & fuel tank off to get access to the cams.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Contacted about 7 bike shops 4 of which were main dealers. None would do a leak down test. The next nearest Suzuki dealer said that the first dealer were not wrong to compression test the TL engine and gave me the following specifications which may be of use to others:
Compression range 142-199
Minimum 99 t
Maximum difference 28
Stated that if both spark plugs were out the engine would spin faster (the assumption I take it is that this will be fast enough for the decompressors to disengage).
Booked in for Tuesday, we'll see what they say.
 

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The Suck, Squeeze, Bang, Blow Moderator,
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Stated that if both spark plugs were out the engine would spin faster (the assumption I take it is that this will be fast enough for the decompressors to disengage).
You can only have one out, the compression tester seals the other.

The starter motor certainly won't spin the engine fast enough to open the bob weights on the cams even with both plugs out, I've done that on new engines to get the oil around.

You can buy leak down testers on ebay pretty cheap, all you need is a long plug adaptor and a friend with a decent size compressor, cheaper than paying a dealer to do a compression check ?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Thanks for the tips. I take it one would have to get the cylinder tested to exactly before TDC on the compression stroke. I could buy a Leak down tester but would find access to a comrpessor difficult. I am sure you have forgotton more than I will ever know and appreciate your support.
 

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Sam what is a leak down test and the benefits of testing it?
Also the same for a compression test/benefits?
 
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