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Discussion Starter #1
HELP PLEASE!.. i have just purchased a 2003 tlr and have a slight problem..the guy i bought the bike from bypassed the clutch switch because he could not get the bike to start from the starter button. when starter button was pushed the bike would just reprime.. i hooked the switch back up because i noticed that the cheap amazon levers he had on the bike weren't engaging the switch fully.. now here lies my current PROBLEM!!!. Now when i try to start the bike,the starter will engage but will not crank motor. The starter CONTINUES to draw power from the battery even after ignition switch is off and kill switch off. i have to hurry and disconnect the connections. If i disconnect the starter from the engine and ground it to case then press starter button, everything works perfect. NO draw and starter cranks fine. Ive checked the ground,checked continuity,changed battery,starter relay and starter. but still draws power only when starter is bolted to engine... im fresh out of ideas can anyone point me in a new direction as to what may be the problem??
 

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Sounds like the solenoid has welded itself shut. I tried using a cheap replacement on mine and it did exactly that first push of the button.

New ones are £70 and despite what anyone may tell you there are no good cheap substitutes. Just buy the OEM version.
 

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Adrenaline Junky
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Can you put a location up?

If you are in the US then order from Ron Ayers #31800-21E20

If you are in the UK then order from Robinsons Foundry same part number.

I guess you are probably state side with a 2003 TLR, I dont think they had them in the UK.

:thumbup
 

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Discussion Starter #4
im in california... i purchased my starter relay from a local suzuki dealership so i figured it should work fine.. but i guess ill purchase another just in case.. thanx
 

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.... i have just purchased a 2003 tlr and have a slight problem..the guy i bought the bike from bypassed the clutch switch because he could not get the bike to start from the starter button. ....
Did the previous owner bump start this TLR? Or, he couldn't start it at all?

Since you have owned this TLR, have you ever heard it crank over?


As snowblind noted, the starter relay is now damaged. A new relay is in order, but before you install it, try to turn the engine over manually. Either put it in a higher gear and try to bump it over by turning the rear wheel, or remove the stator bolt access cover and use a 17mm socket to turn the engine CCW.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
im located in sacramento ,and yes before i purchased the bike i manuly turned the engine with a socket.. everything turned fine. i havent tried to bump start it yet because im afraid that once started if there is an electrical problem. the bike might fry the harness or something haha.
 

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..... If i disconnect the starter from the engine and ground it to case then press starter button, everything works perfect. NO draw and starter cranks fine
Sac huh, I'm just down in the bay.

Ok, I'm confused. :O So are you saying that with the positive cable to the starter, connected to the engine case, you can crank the bike as normal? :confused
 

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If i disconnect the starter from the engine and ground it to case then press starter button, everything works perfect. NO draw and starter cranks fine.
I'm taking your comment to say that you unbolted and physically removed the starter motor from the engine. Then, with the starter cable attached to the starter motor, you 'grounded' the starter housing to the engine case to complete the circuit. Then, when the starter button is pressed, the starter motor spins freely. Of course, there is no load on it. Correct?

Technically, there IS a current draw because the starter is spinning. However, maybe what you intended to say is that there is no runaway current draw because the relay does not stick in the closed condition. If so, then the reason is because there is no load on the starter motor, therefore it requires much less current to spin, and the lower current is not enough to weld the contacts together in the relay.



Ive checked the ground,checked continuity,changed battery,starter relay and starter. but still draws power only when starter is bolted to engine... im fresh out of ideas can anyone point me in a new direction as to what may be the problem??
Your next test should be something like this.

First get a serviceable starter relay. It doesn't have to be a Suzuki relay, but it needs to be able to handle the load.

Put the starter motor back on the engine as it should be and connect the cable.

If you have already replaced the relay that was fried earlier, that's fine. Otherwise, rig a way to trigger the non-Suzuki relay. Or, if nothing else is available, a screwdriver blade across the relay terminals will work. (I just don't like all the sparks.)

Connect your volt meter across the battery terminals so that it will stay connected - hands free.

Now, key on, and attempt to crank the engine over while monitoring the volt meter. How low does the voltage go while cranking the engine?

If the engine fails to crank immediately, don't hold the button in. You don't want to destroy another relay. Be quick about observing the voltage drop.

Whether it cranks over or not, you'll want to take another measurement across the starter motor. Connect the voltmeter to a good chassis ground point and the starter cable terminal on the starter motor - also hands free connections. There will be no voltage displayed until you attempt to crank the engine over. Again, monitor the voltmeter when attempting to crank. You should see nearly the same loaded voltage across the starter that you saw across the battery.

If you see significantly less voltage across the starter motor, that tells you another component in the system is causing a voltage drop in the circuit - effectively stealing power from the starter.

Since the engine can be manually turned over, it is not locked. So then, the components that can prevent it from electrically cranking over are:
  1. battery
  2. starter relay
  3. starter motor
  4. starter/battery cables
It is convenient that you have spare parts to swap out.

Let us know what you find.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
sorry its taken me forever to reply, but after 14 hour work days 6 days a week. i finally took the the time to work on the bike.. so here it is.. turns out it was a bad ignition. i had a spare tried it and the motor cranked perfect buuuuuuuuuuuuuuttttt. now there is no neutral light on and bike will not prime unless i have kick stand up ....?????????? any suggestion on my new problem
 

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.... now there is no neutral light on and bike will not prime unless i have kick stand up ....?????????? any suggestion on my new problem
You'll notice in the diagram below that the neutral light gets its ground connection through the GPS. Also, the ECM senses that ground connection through the switch itself. Since neither of these features are working, it may be that the GPS contacts are dirty (oxidized) - it happens. That's why the ECM needs to see the side stand switch activated before it issues the fuel pump prime command. The Ring-In has outlined a method to clean the contacts on the GPS, but the switch must be removed from the engine to perform that service.

Before you go to that extent, be sure the wires leading up to the GPS are good and unmolested. Also, if there is a TRE fitted, it could be part of the problem.

 

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Discussion Starter #13
ok guys, ive checked everything. ever sensor, continuity,grounds and everything turns out fine. ive cleaned all contact and even swapped out the ecm with a old on i had that i know is perfect and still NO neutral light.. also i checked the gauges and the light works.. but now when bike is started the tach doesnt work!! i have CHEC on dash.. this is really frustrating.. i think ill just change whe whole harness itself im really out of ideas
 

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Simple things first:is the lamp ok in your neutral?
 

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ok guys, ive checked everything. ever sensor, continuity,grounds and everything turns out fine. ive cleaned all contact and even swapped out the ecm with a old on i had that i know is perfect and still NO neutral light.. also i checked the gauges and the light works...
Did you actually remove and clean the Gear Position Switch (GPS)? That is where the Neutral light gets its ground connection. When the tranny is in nuetral, the GPS connects the Blue wire to ground, which closes the circuit to illuminate the light.

If you can measure good continuity on the Blue/Blk wire from the instrument cluster connector to the Side Stand Relay (SSR) terminal; then from the Dark Blue wire on the SSR all the way to the GPS connector - the chances are good that the GPS is preventing a ground connection.

There is a pair of diodes inside the SSR that will prevent a continuity reading in one measurement from the cluster to the GPS, but you can use the "diode mode" on your meter to verify the diode in the SSR.

The diode pair is circled in the diagram below.




... but now when bike is started the tach doesnt work!! i have CHEC on dash.....
Since the engine starts, that tells you the Kill Switch, or the Side Stand Switch are NOT causing the "CHEC" message to appear.

The problem is associated with the wires that pass through the Black gang connector from the main loom to the front loom. Those are the communication wires from the ECM to the instrument cluster. If the communication is hindered, then the instruments will display CHEC as the default response.

You may need to do a continuity check from the gauge connector all the way to the ECM connector to find which wire is the problem.

The Black gang connector is circled in the diagram below.

 
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