TLZone Forums banner

1 - 20 of 33 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,379 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Looking to get into some Bench rest shooting on a budget of course. While dribbling over pretty rifles i mentioned that i wanted to shoot past 500 yrds and not have the bullet drop directly on the other side of the paper target. My 223 loses its punch at those ranges. The gunshop mentioned the 6.5-284 cartridge and i sat there saying :dowhat. The idea is to build up a BR rifle with the ability to go out to 500-1000 yrds starting off of the savage F Class rifle (remember budget). Does anyone have any experience with this cartridge or this rifle? Close to the bottom. Or the ins and outs of bench rest?

My current set up is a savage model 12 .223 1:9 twist barrel



The gun can currently out shoot the operator. (150yrds) Best group was 0.56" spread.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,955 Posts
PM SonnyD...He is an expert on this kind of stuff...I only know tactical weapons for the most part...6.5 and 6.8 anything are faily new rounds ( to my knowledge ) on the market...I don't know about civilian precision shooting rifles, but i do know that 6.5 AR-15 rounds are pretty capable rounds and hella lot better than .223...Whats the grain is that round?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,526 Posts
The summary of my knowledge of any wildcat cartridge is that I have no interest in them. Especially one using an off the wall case like a .284 Winchester. Commercial loads are impossible to find and good brass to neck down to accept the 6.5mm bullet isn't going to be easy. :dunno

Edit: After some reading I see that there is commercially available brass from Lapua, Norma and Hornady. I would still rather use a round that is commercially available since reloading takes way too much time and can be pretty costly to get into.
 

·
Moderator,
Joined
·
8,251 Posts
The summary of my knowledge of any wildcat cartridge is that I have no interest in them. Especially one using an off the wall case like a .284 Winchester. Commercial loads are impossible to find and good brass to neck down to accept the 6.5mm bullet isn't going to be easy. :dunno
Not familiar with benchrest crazies are you AirNavy? They tend toward :coocoo, kind of like TL riders.:laugh I'm not into benchrest myself but I do know that is a popular cartridge within that sport at the moment.

NineDV you seem to under the impression that "benchrest shooting on a budget" is not a oxymoron.:lol Much like the TL it will lure you in with the promise that you can make do and then when you're hooked, WHAM! the number of things you absolutely need suddenly becomes clear.:lol
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,526 Posts
I admit that I know nothing of the benchrest world. :laugh I accept that an off the rack, bone stock AR made by a reputable company is probably much more accurate out to 500 yards than I will ever be. That's why I focus on improving my functional skillset in that area while having fun putting expensive holes in cheap paper. :laugh
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
676 Posts
I have a 284 :) Browning BLR. Made 1 year and man is it a little kicker!

If you want a good gun at a decent price try looking at the CZ1000 yard rifle. 300 win mag and its pretty accurate and will have plenty of punch out at 500 yards. I have a 25-06 tactical savage that with cut 3 holes at 100 yards with a cheap ass scope. My 204 is pretty close to that with a $25 scope. Honestly though Savage has a 308 bench rifle that is pretty good. Cheaper amo and easy to dial in with low level of kick.

If my hunting rifles DONT shoot under 1" groups at 100 they go down the road. Case in point my fathers 7mm Browning Medallion is the worst shooting gun we have. Savage guns have some of the most accurate barrel's on the market.(I have 4 of them) The 6.5's are good but I prefer a 308 (I like 30 cal bullets!). I like to know I am shooting a gun. Now if you want something that kicks you can stop by and shoot my Remmington XCR in 375 Ultra Mag. That has just a smidge more recoil than say a 257 roberts LOL (which I have in a Rem Mountain Rifle that was made 1 year.) :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
819 Posts
FWIW

it was said that 6.5 is fairly new

perhaps the chambering you mention but the caliber itself is quite old indeed

I have a sporterized 96 Mauser in 6.5X55 Swede stamped
Carl Gustav 1900
on the receiver

nice gun, kills good, 6.5 is a super caliber for LRT

tried to copy and paste from Lee Shooter ballistics generator but couldn't:banghead

sorry I can't add more
as far as I am concerned a ultra accurate rifle is like a 400mph bike
pretty cool but I am more concerned with practical rifle shooting and things other than top speed
:O

happy shootin
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
819 Posts
ok, disregard my last post

the only thing I would add to it is that the 6.5 has a place in my heart because it is such a light kicker

I found this article
http://www.gunsandammomag.com/reloads/0610/index.html

sounds like a damn good round

I also have a 300 win mag and the thing kicks the livin shit out of you after about 25+ rounds of heavy handloads (faster load seems to always be most accurate right up to measuring case head expansion)

I say go with the 6.5

damn good killer anyway which is lots more than you can say for lots of these sissy target rounds

and it like 4350 !! :pirate
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,379 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Defender, my 223 tends to like to shoot the heavier grain bullets. 69grn SMK work well but i have had best results with the 75 grn burger Vld. Best group shot outta the lil savage was a 4 shot 0.56" group at 150 yrds.

The 6.5 bullet coupled with the 284 case seems appealing to me as bullets with a high ballistics coefficient can be found and the case seems to not wallop you as much as the 300 win mag.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
819 Posts
yeah, not wallop as much is the understatement of the week

there are a whole host of 6.5 cartridges (or have been)

I've always wanted to build a 6.5-06

just 06 brass with a neckdown
hot ballistics though
http://www.handloads.org/loaddata/d...06&Weight=All&type=Rifle&Order=Powder&Source=

as more of a traditional sort of guy I find myself unimpressed with fancy pants brass and exotic cartridges.

the 270 is a great spin off of the 30-06 but could use a higher Bc and SD
the 6.5-06 offers heavier bullets (which actually IMPROVE ballistics) with equal velocity, and better terminal performance

besides, match brass could probably be had real cheap once fired !

sorting a group of 100 once fires down to 20 uniform cases hurts less than doing the same with new high dollar brass

tell me to shut up if I'm not being useful
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
183 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
819 Posts
300 win mag ftw...sorry for the lack of input but i love that caliber
excessive recoil
excessive muzzle blast
excessive powder consumption (with a 190= 70-75ish vs 140= 45-50ish)
throat life around 1500 rounds IIRC

I'm just saying....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
819 Posts
also, there is a 6.5-08 but it isn't called that

it's a 260 remington

nearly identical to the 6.5X55 but using easier to get 308 brass

AA puts a 140 SRA HPBT @2740 max

308 or 243 brass will work
it has been a silhouette cartridge for a long time so accurate rifles should be available
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
360 Posts
Most of my shooting has been full bore target (.308) out to 1000 yards but dabbled in benchrest too.

The 6.5-284 is a good choice between 500-1000 yards, but only if you have a rifle that can realise that potential and hot handloads to do the job. The 6.5 Super, an improved 6.5-284 is the same. But to be accurate you will be spending big dollars on the gun. I had a bit of success with the 6mm family of cartridges like the 6mmPPC and 6.5-284.

Here are a couple of shots of those types of BR rifles.

This is a 6mmPPC light Varmint BR rifle


This is a 6.5-284 in Heavy Varmint


This is what you can expect going to play in heavy gun with .30 cal family....but big $$$


If on a budget and starting out I would strongly suggest more on the .30 cal family, like the standard .308, the .300 Weatherby Magnum, the .338 Lapua or even the Roberts family of cartridges. That way you have plenty of muzzle energy with a decent grain bullet that will not lose energy, create excessive trajectory drop or be effected by winds too much. You can also pick up a BR gun for these at reasonable $.

Whatever you choose you will be doing plenty of handloading and experimenting with different bullet weights and shapes and powder types and amounts. Be sure to record all you do as temperatures and humidity can and will play a large part of your accuracy.

The sport can be extremely expensive but you should talk to a Benchrest Captain or some of the competitors as they can give you good advice from real experience....and often know what guys are selling guns that might suit your budget and get you started.

Caution though the sport is extremely addictive as 1crock said. I was lucky I had fullbore target and combat pistol already to distract me.

Here is example of how far things can go in search of perfect accuracy and tiny groups. This is Charlie Bailey in North Carolina in 2000 on the 1000 yard target line. The rifle weighs 150lbs :devious


Here is Charlie's gun cart to move his amazing 150lb beast


Whatever you do enjoy, I loved my target shooting for many years and still think about going back to it.

Cheers, D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,379 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
:drool
love the stock on that thing.... tell me more. :yes
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
676 Posts
ok, disregard my last post

the only thing I would add to it is that the 6.5 has a place in my heart because it is such a light kicker

I found this article
http://www.gunsandammomag.com/reloads/0610/index.html

sounds like a damn good round

I also have a 300 win mag and the thing kicks the livin shit out of you after about 25+ rounds of heavy handloads (faster load seems to always be most accurate right up to measuring case head expansion)

I say go with the 6.5

damn good killer anyway which is lots more than you can say for lots of these sissy target rounds

and it like 4350 !! :pirate
4350 isnt a fast burning powder but I have found it works better in my 300 win mag for being accurate.

excessive recoil
excessive muzzle blast
excessive powder consumption (with a 190= 70-75ish vs 140= 45-50ish)
throat life around 1500 rounds IIRC

I'm just saying....
Excessive recoil? Never noticed it....its a plinker compared to my 375 ultra mag
Excessive muzzle blast? Quite quiet compared to my 338 with a muzzle break
Excessive powder consumption? Yes it takes more but more is more....regardless of how you swing it.
1500 rounds? Very true but its better then 500 rounds from the 7mm ultra mag till those things are shot out. A lot has to do with HOW HOT you load it. Me I like to load 74gr of 4350 with 180 gr Ballstic Tip Boat Tails. Great for hunting about anything in North America. But like you said its got some kick being that its a Winchester Model 70, with a synthetic stock and the crappy stock hard rubber but plate....lol

I agree with you a lot.......but I'm just saying....haha

How about a 243 short mag? Those shoot about 4200+ fps at the muzzle and are quite accurate.
 

·
Scooter hottie chauffeur
Joined
·
4,663 Posts
most of the camp Perry 1000yd folks use a .30 cal bullet, either .308 or a .30 cal wild cat .416 Rigby (Ackley improved) necked down to .30cal running between 260- 280 grains bullet weight seems to be fairly normal... Now remember those guys are actually shooting (not bench rest) and all they have to do is put a hole in a bit of paper so there isn't much left to the round out past a grand. guys say they can find the bullets laying on top of the grass behind the targets (Camp Perry uses lake Hurron as the back stop).

there are guys working on a .416 cal bullet in a .50 BMG case that shoots flatter then the big .50 and has killing energy out past a mile for military purposes.

I would think there are quite a few parts to be had in the .50 BMG family, to build the foundation off of... then come up with a barrel chambered in "NineDV-improved" I wouldn't go smaller then .35 cal with that monster case behind it, throat erosion would just be insane but a .416 to .470 should give you a bullet weight that will go the distance, not get kicked around too much by the wind, and will put ordinance on target.

show us what you got going as you progress, I'd love to see that build.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
676 Posts
most of the camp Perry 1000yd folks use a .30 cal bullet, either .308 or a .30 cal wild cat .416 Rigby (Ackley improved) necked down to .30cal running between 260- 280 grains bullet weight seems to be fairly normal... Now remember those guys are actually shooting (not bench rest) and all they have to do is put a hole in a bit of paper so there isn't much left to the round out past a grand. guys say they can find the bullets laying on top of the grass behind the targets (Camp Perry uses lake Hurron as the back stop).

there are guys working on a .416 cal bullet in a .50 BMG case that shoots flatter then the big .50 and has killing energy out past a mile for military purposes.

I would think there are quite a few parts to be had in the .50 BMG family, to build the foundation off of... then come up with a barrel chambered in "NineDV-improved" I wouldn't go smaller then .35 cal with that monster case behind it, throat erosion would just be insane but a .416 to .470 should give you a bullet weight that will go the distance, not get kicked around too much by the wind, and will put ordinance on target.

show us what you got going as you progress, I'd love to see that build.
I have seen some of the wildcats you speak of and the ballistics are fantastic. Plus like you said the wind doesnt have quite the impact on them as smaller rounds.

If he isn shooting 500 yards the sky is the limit for his choices. It will come down to what he wants.

At that range I would say a 308 with the Weatherby Magnum rounds would be good. Still a short action but is halfway between a 30-06 and a 300 win mag. Expensive ammo but you can also shoot the cheapo stuff and reload for a fraction of the cost.
 
1 - 20 of 33 Posts
Top