help and advice needed pls

The Ring-In · 07-07-2008, 04:35 PM

I found some interesting info recently on alternate sustainable power devices.

I am planning to build a conversion for the TL using the 'cat and buttered bread Infinite power engine"

the engine uses the contrary principles of cats always falling on their feet and bread always falling butter side down.

put simply a piece of buttered bread is glued to the back of a cat and the pair dropped form a safe height .

as the cat and bread approach the ground the contrary forces of each item try to establish their correct position. the cat struggles to place its feet down and the bread strugggles to rotate the cat so it can land butter down.

A simple pulley and belt arrangement transfers this frantic rotational force and it is fed to a suitable transmission.

So far no information is available as to specific power output but those of you who know me would be aware of my pet called arthur a 6.5 kilo desexed tom cat who is pure muscle. obviously balancing the size of bread and butter to offset the strength of the cat is an important consideration. as one overpowering the other would result in the bike stalling .

If you would like to contibute to this project your thoughts and technical input would be greatly appreciated.

cheers stu

jagboy1 · 07-07-2008, 04:49 PM

**1crock** · 07-07-2008, 06:27 PM

Perpetual motion may just be possible! I'd use grape jelly instead of butter though. The greater chance of staining increases it's chance of landing jelly side down. Should see a significant increase in torque from the jelly.

The Ring-In · 07-07-2008, 06:46 PM

Good point!

MotoTiller · 07-07-2008, 07:01 PM

And start off with a nice dark rye loaf.

The Ring-In · 07-07-2008, 07:09 PM

I'm starting to see a pattern here, Thanks for the input.

I'm guessing you think the rye has higher energy and a longer shelf life with less likelyhood of moulding.

I am a bit concerned that arthur (who has a taste for pizza) may try to eat the bread so any choices would have to be of one he doesn't like or perhaps have an additive to make it unpalatable to him.

Worst case scenario I guess i'll have to post a wanted to buy for a non wheat eating moggie.

cheers stu

AirNavy · 07-07-2008, 07:17 PM

You could use Arthur's carb attraction as a kind of supercharger. Basically you will get extra horsepower as he trys to rotate his head/body around to grab the bread off of his back. You will have to figure out a way to control when he does it though or it will be random bursts of extra energy.

ITSMESTEVE · 07-07-2008, 07:30 PM

This would work well as long as you are not playing "Better Than Life"

(A Red Dwarf reference)

MotoTiller · 07-07-2008, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ring-In

I'm starting to see a pattern here, Thanks for the input.

I'm guessing you think the rye has higher energy and a longer shelf life with less likelyhood of moulding.

I am a bit concerned that arthur (who has a taste for pizza) may try to eat the bread so any choices would have to be of one he doesn't like or perhaps have an additive to make it unpalatable to him.

Worst case scenario I guess i'll have to post a wanted to buy for a non wheat eating moggie.

cheers stu

Perhaps Vegemite or Shrimp Cheese could help in that area.

chucks_net · 07-07-2008, 10:25 PM

Well to balance the cats simply glue 2 cats back 2 back. Works like a charm.

So you can make a simple motorcycle in this fasion. Glue 2 or more cats back 2 back around an axle for front and back tires on a bike. Starting the bike is much like push starting a motor bike.

I must warm you though, if the cats get pissy it can be really hard to work on the engine.

chucks_net · 07-07-2008, 11:07 PM

The Ring-In · 07-08-2008, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Well to balance the cats simply glue 2 cats back 2 back

I hadn't even considered that!

I wonder if there is any reason why I couldn't place multiple cats around an axle in the fashion of a radial engine. by having an uneven number of cats the engine may even be self starting.

datrat240 · 07-08-2008, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chucks_net

Hmm lets see, Once spinning, If the downward forces were nulled as either side goes up,so that only one pulls down at at time then with:

Average Moment arm length = 0.2m (has to sill fit in the TL)
Cat mass = Buttered toast mass = 6.5kg (balanced crank!) = 64N(ish) force
Torque = F*R = 12.8Nm peak (8ish Nm ave?)
so if they spin at say 12,600rads/sec (= roughly 2000revs/sec =120,000rpm)

Then we get a perpetual engine producing about a 100kW (135hp)!!!
-so it should go like TL

So as long as the butter doesn't fly off the toast, and the cat doesn't explode at 120,000rpm You're set!

**1crock** · 07-08-2008, 08:12 AM

datrat, have you considered that you may have too much free time on your hands?

MotoTiller · 07-08-2008, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ring-In

I hadn't even considered that!

I wonder if there is any reason why I couldn't place multiple cats around an axle in the fashion of a radial engine. by having an uneven number of cats the engine may even be self starting.

Multiples might be a bit difficult to maintain, you will need to ensure that the lead cat is in heat and that the others are non neutered males for maximum power. For an extra boost catnip should do the trick but will require at least a 30 minute cooling down period afterwards.

MotoTiller · 07-08-2008, 05:15 PM

Has anyone considered the durability of Apple Butter?


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07-07-2008, 04:35 PM	#1 (permalink)
The Ring-In Silver Subscriber Member #12363 Posts: 1,372 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brisbane Qld Sportsbike: 97 tl1000s Riding Experience: 32 years Trader Rating: (4) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 5 Days and 8:29:53 Hours The Ring-In's Garage The Ring-In don't ride with me I'm a rain god	help and advice needed pls I found some interesting info recently on alternate sustainable power devices. I am planning to build a conversion for the TL using the 'cat and buttered bread Infinite power engine" the engine uses the contrary principles of cats always falling on their feet and bread always falling butter side down. put simply a piece of buttered bread is glued to the back of a cat and the pair dropped form a safe height . as the cat and bread approach the ground the contrary forces of each item try to establish their correct position. the cat struggles to place its feet down and the bread strugggles to rotate the cat so it can land butter down. A simple pulley and belt arrangement transfers this frantic rotational force and it is fed to a suitable transmission. So far no information is available as to specific power output but those of you who know me would be aware of my pet called arthur a 6.5 kilo desexed tom cat who is pure muscle. obviously balancing the size of bread and butter to offset the strength of the cat is an important consideration. as one overpowering the other would result in the bike stalling . If you would like to contibute to this project your thoughts and technical input would be greatly appreciated. cheers stu __________________ Cheers Stu oggi knobs. anodised barends, heli bars. arrow cans, custom rear peg mounts, white power shock, hugger, undertail, clear tail light lens, PC 11 , modded airbox, K&N air filter, 6 spots, braided front lines, polished rims and colour matched painted wheel spokes, fan override switch , TRE, tank bra, american high capacity battery, sv650 grab rail,RGV250 front guard.

07-07-2008, 04:49 PM	#2 (permalink)
jagboy1 Silver Subscriber Member #5251 Posts: 1,742 Join Date: May 2005 Location: warwick,uk Sportsbike: tl1000sv,cb1100r Riding Experience: definately Trader Rating: (11) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 4 Days and 22:27:16 Hours jagboy1's Garage jagboy1	__________________ TL1000SV(97),tlr motor with 1040 bore kit,,radiused inlets,flowed heads,modded airbox with tlr bell mouths,k & n filter,lightened flywheel,,57mm downpipes with matching one off cams, + and ground mods.pc3 with custom map,six pots with braided hoses,05 gold on gold busa forks, ohlins rear shock,tlr swingarm,metzeler racetecs(rear 190/55/17)two teeth up on rear sprocket.

07-07-2008, 06:27 PM	#3 (permalink)
1crock Moderator Member #249 Posts: 5,452 Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Dalton, Ohio Sportsbike: 1978 GS 1000E, 2002 TL1000R, 1965 Honda Dream, Small batch of dirt bikes Riding Experience: 36 years - more to come. Trader Rating: (10) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 6 Days and 20:53:05 Hours 1crock's Garage 1crock has no witty saying for	Perpetual motion may just be possible! I'd use grape jelly instead of butter though. The greater chance of staining increases it's chance of landing jelly side down. Should see a significant increase in torque from the jelly. __________________ "The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles." Colonel Jeff Cooper, in "The Art of the Rifle" Jeff TLZone Forums Staff - Resident Stodgy ME Questions about the Forums? *Click Here*

07-07-2008, 06:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
The Ring-In Silver Subscriber Member #12363 Posts: 1,372 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brisbane Qld Sportsbike: 97 tl1000s Riding Experience: 32 years Trader Rating: (4) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 5 Days and 8:29:53 Hours The Ring-In's Garage The Ring-In don't ride with me I'm a rain god	Good point! __________________ Cheers Stu oggi knobs. anodised barends, heli bars. arrow cans, custom rear peg mounts, white power shock, hugger, undertail, clear tail light lens, PC 11 , modded airbox, K&N air filter, 6 spots, braided front lines, polished rims and colour matched painted wheel spokes, fan override switch , TRE, tank bra, american high capacity battery, sv650 grab rail,RGV250 front guard.

07-07-2008, 07:01 PM	#5 (permalink)
MotoTiller Taunter Member #613 Posts: 10,445 Join Date: May 2003 Location: Central Texas Sportsbike: Virtual NSR500 Riding Experience: Got some Trader Rating: (11) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 1 Week, 2 Days and 4:18:43 Hours MotoTiller's Garage MotoTiller is crazy	And start off with a nice dark rye loaf. __________________ Ed MotoGP Racing Clan

07-07-2008, 07:09 PM	#6 (permalink)
The Ring-In Silver Subscriber Member #12363 Posts: 1,372 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Brisbane Qld Sportsbike: 97 tl1000s Riding Experience: 32 years Trader Rating: (4) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 5 Days and 8:29:53 Hours The Ring-In's Garage The Ring-In don't ride with me I'm a rain god	I'm starting to see a pattern here, Thanks for the input. I'm guessing you think the rye has higher energy and a longer shelf life with less likelyhood of moulding. I am a bit concerned that arthur (who has a taste for pizza) may try to eat the bread so any choices would have to be of one he doesn't like or perhaps have an additive to make it unpalatable to him. Worst case scenario I guess i'll have to post a wanted to buy for a non wheat eating moggie. cheers stu __________________ Cheers Stu oggi knobs. anodised barends, heli bars. arrow cans, custom rear peg mounts, white power shock, hugger, undertail, clear tail light lens, PC 11 , modded airbox, K&N air filter, 6 spots, braided front lines, polished rims and colour matched painted wheel spokes, fan override switch , TRE, tank bra, american high capacity battery, sv650 grab rail,RGV250 front guard.

07-07-2008, 07:17 PM	#7 (permalink)
AirNavy 13 Button Pimp Member #794 Posts: 3,095 Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Pensacola, FL Sportsbike: 01 TLR / 04 VTX1800 Riding Experience: 13 yrs Trader Rating: (84) Pictures: 1 Life Wasted on TLZone: 1 Week, 1 Day and 23:05:15 Hours AirNavy's Garage AirNavy is not nearly as anti-social as he seems.	You could use Arthur's carb attraction as a kind of supercharger. Basically you will get extra horsepower as he trys to rotate his head/body around to grab the bread off of his back. You will have to figure out a way to control when he does it though or it will be random bursts of extra energy. __________________ Mickey AEC (AW) US Navy MySpace Page "How many times must I say I'm not sorry and how many ways can I show I don't care?" ...A Dish Best Served Coldly-Type O Negative

07-07-2008, 07:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
ITSMESTEVE Silver Subscriber Member #11561 Posts: 633 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Brisbane,AUSTRALIA Sportsbike: 98 TLR just looks like an '02 Riding Experience: 26 Yrs Trader Rating: (11) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 1 Month, 0 Weeks, 6 Days and 4:44:28 Hours ITSMESTEVE's Garage ITSMESTEVE :a slow old man on a cool bike	This would work well as long as you are not playing "Better Than Life" (A Red Dwarf reference) __________________ Red 98 TLR but looks like a yellow 02.Full Yoshi system ,airbox mod,Bitubo rear,Racetech front springs,re-valved forks,SS brake lines,digital gear display/TRE,TLRstacker Sliders,Rifleman 1/5 throttle,Vandriver swingarm pivots ,Pipercross filter,Pazzo levers,Vandriver tailrisers,PowerCommander lll...and counting. .......... PICK THE POINT IN THE SIG WHERE I JOINED TLZ

07-07-2008, 10:25 PM	#10 (permalink)
chucks_net never play leapfrog with a unicorn Member #4998 Posts: 3,116 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: CT USA Sportsbike: 02 TLR, 02 TLR Streetfighter, 02 CBR Stunter Riding Experience: Learn every time I'm out Trader Rating: (10) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 2 Days and 14:13:37 Hours chucks_net's Garage chucks_net	Well to balance the cats simply glue 2 cats back 2 back. Works like a charm. So you can make a simple motorcycle in this fasion. Glue 2 or more cats back 2 back around an axle for front and back tires on a bike. Starting the bike is much like push starting a motor bike. I must warm you though, if the cats get pissy it can be really hard to work on the engine. __________________ My Site The TL1000 Section and my mods Free ECU Mapping Here TL FAQ

07-07-2008, 11:07 PM	#11 (permalink)
chucks_net never play leapfrog with a unicorn Member #4998 Posts: 3,116 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: CT USA Sportsbike: 02 TLR, 02 TLR Streetfighter, 02 CBR Stunter Riding Experience: Learn every time I'm out Trader Rating: (10) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 2 Days and 14:13:37 Hours chucks_net's Garage chucks_net	__________________ My Site The TL1000 Section and my mods Free ECU Mapping Here TL FAQ

07-08-2008, 08:12 AM	#14 (permalink)
1crock Moderator Member #249 Posts: 5,452 Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Dalton, Ohio Sportsbike: 1978 GS 1000E, 2002 TL1000R, 1965 Honda Dream, Small batch of dirt bikes Riding Experience: 36 years - more to come. Trader Rating: (10) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 2 Weeks, 6 Days and 20:53:05 Hours 1crock's Garage 1crock has no witty saying for	datrat, have you considered that you may have too much free time on your hands? __________________ "The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles." Colonel Jeff Cooper, in "The Art of the Rifle" Jeff TLZone Forums Staff - Resident Stodgy ME Questions about the Forums? *Click Here*

07-08-2008, 05:15 PM	#16 (permalink)
MotoTiller Taunter Member #613 Posts: 10,445 Join Date: May 2003 Location: Central Texas Sportsbike: Virtual NSR500 Riding Experience: Got some Trader Rating: (11) Pictures: 0 Life Wasted on TLZone: 1 Week, 2 Days and 4:18:43 Hours MotoTiller's Garage MotoTiller is crazy	Has anyone considered the durability of Apple Butter? __________________ Ed MotoGP Racing Clan